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This group is not affiliated with the CAC or CACG grading services or trademarks. It is an unofficial and unsponsored third party club. We support the company and provide a community for discussion and collaboration around the subject of CAC and CACG coins. Their trademarks are their own. By entering and leveraging this group you enter at your own risk.
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This is a private forum for its members to interact. Neither this group nor its administrators shall be responsible for any transactions or activities which take place between members.
Any and all transactions which take place between members are private dealings only between those parties. Any and all buyers/sellers should take all necessary precautions prior to dealing with one another. Above all else, CAVEAT EMPTOR... members beware and protect yourselves.
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- NiceNice
- 2024-03-01 01:58:32
- Are you going for a complete set from CACG? I'm assuming the scuffs are on the slabs and not the coins.Are you going for a complete set from CACG? I'm assuming the scuffs are on the slabs and not the coins.
- 2024-01-18 21:54:12
- TimeCapsuleCoins I dont collect these was just testing out some crossovers.[TimeCapsuleCoins] I dont collect these was just testing out some crossovers.
- 2024-01-18 22:38:21
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- A picture is worth a thousand wordsA picture is worth a thousand words
8 Comments 2 Shares 4254 ViewsCommenting is disabled. - Now that there are more than 10 CACG sample slabs, I had to change my set to a box of twenty set. I'm still missing 2 coins. DM me if you have a 2005-P Witter U sample or an IMEX sample for sale!Now that there are more than 10 CACG sample slabs, I had to change my set to a box of twenty set. I'm still missing 2 coins. DM me if you have a 2005-P Witter U sample or an IMEX sample for sale!I've just added a set "Elite CACG Samples Collection" (Box of Twenty Set).4 Comments 0 Shares 2892 Views
- Ok now my turn to try a video...Ok now my turn to try a video...6 Comments 0 Shares 3226 Views 611Commenting is disabled.
- So many early coppers suffer weak / uneven strike or rough surfaces. Does anyone know what is the difference between rough surfaces that get the CAC sticker and environmental damage that doesn't sticker or gets a details grade?So many early coppers suffer weak / uneven strike or rough surfaces. Does anyone know what is the difference between rough surfaces that get the CAC sticker and environmental damage that doesn't sticker or gets a details grade?11 Comments 0 Shares 4033 ViewsCommenting is disabled.
- is that a strike though on obverse?is that a strike though on obverse?
- 2024-01-17 21:12:19
- EasternIowaBrian You may be seeing the wave in liberty's hair at 12:00, the flan flaw in front of her nose, or the pole at her neck. There are no strike throughs I can discern.[EasternIowaBrian] You may be seeing the wave in liberty's hair at 12:00, the flan flaw in front of her nose, or the pole at her neck. There are no strike throughs I can discern.
- 2024-01-18 05:36:20
- Although this piece doesn't corroborate my potentially misinformed comment earlier, chapter 7 touches on some of the problems with the rolled copper and punch mechanism (there are other mentions of similar, too), which at the least could affect the resulting coin even before struck. Granted, this was during Confederation period, but I imagine some issues persisted, nonetheless.
The full linked piece is long, but may be of interest.
"COINING TECHNOLOGY DURING THE CONFEDERATION
The state coinages of the Confederation period are a fascinating series. While much is known about them and the circumstances of their manufacture, significantly more remains undiscovered. Many of the actual coins themselves reside today in the cabinets of individual numismatists and in museum collections, but none of the punches, dies, presses or other hardware used in the minting process is reported to have survived.2 The information we have is derived from examination of the coins themselves and existing historical records such as legal proceedings, contracts, legislative debate and enactments, newspaper accounts, and sundry other contemporary documents. A large number of coppers from this period are "orphans" in that nothing is recorded about their provenance.
A great deal of information has been preserved regarding eighteenth century English mints,3 but it is unwise and inaccurate to apply these facts uncritically to America. Spilman has studied the technology of coining used in America during this period.4 He qualifies his conclusions about colonial minting practices since they were based on visual observations and recognizes the need for firmer laboratory evidence. The major technical problem confronting the Confederation mintmaster was the inability to produce and roll planchet stock to uniform dimension. Many inherent technical problems can be envisioned in this rudimentary rolling process, including the ambient temperature, and the alignment, compliance, and resiliance of the iron rollers. For example, a decrease in roller spacing from 1.71 to 1.61 millimeters could reduce the final weight of a Connecticut copper, 28 millimeters in diameter, from the authorized 144.0 to 135.3 grains.5 Residual striations impressed on the surfaces of copper fillets by the rough surfaces of the cast iron rollers are commonly seen on finished Connecticut coins when the planchets were insufficiently annealed, or softened, prior to striking.6 Crosby relates how planchets for Massachusetts coppers were cast into ingots at the Boston mint and then carted to nearby Dedham where the copper "was drawn under a trip-hammer, and rolled into sheets, when it was returned to the mint, where the blanks were prepared and the coin stamped."7 The rolling procedure practiced in England was more complex where the fillets were initially prepared in a horse or water powered "roughing mill," and then passed through a power driven "finishing mill" prior to being brought to exact dimensions by passage through a set of polished, hardened, steel rollers on a hand operated "drag-bench."8"
http://numismatics.org/digitallibrary/ark:/53695/nnan48359Although this piece doesn't corroborate my potentially misinformed comment earlier, chapter 7 touches on some of the problems with the rolled copper and punch mechanism (there are other mentions of similar, too), which at the least could affect the resulting coin even before struck. Granted, this was during Confederation period, but I imagine some issues persisted, nonetheless. The full linked piece is long, but may be of interest. "COINING TECHNOLOGY DURING THE CONFEDERATION The state coinages of the Confederation period are a fascinating series. While much is known about them and the circumstances of their manufacture, significantly more remains undiscovered. Many of the actual coins themselves reside today in the cabinets of individual numismatists and in museum collections, but none of the punches, dies, presses or other hardware used in the minting process is reported to have survived.2 The information we have is derived from examination of the coins themselves and existing historical records such as legal proceedings, contracts, legislative debate and enactments, newspaper accounts, and sundry other contemporary documents. A large number of coppers from this period are "orphans" in that nothing is recorded about their provenance. A great deal of information has been preserved regarding eighteenth century English mints,3 but it is unwise and inaccurate to apply these facts uncritically to America. Spilman has studied the technology of coining used in America during this period.4 He qualifies his conclusions about colonial minting practices since they were based on visual observations and recognizes the need for firmer laboratory evidence. The major technical problem confronting the Confederation mintmaster was the inability to produce and roll planchet stock to uniform dimension. Many inherent technical problems can be envisioned in this rudimentary rolling process, including the ambient temperature, and the alignment, compliance, and resiliance of the iron rollers. For example, a decrease in roller spacing from 1.71 to 1.61 millimeters could reduce the final weight of a Connecticut copper, 28 millimeters in diameter, from the authorized 144.0 to 135.3 grains.5 Residual striations impressed on the surfaces of copper fillets by the rough surfaces of the cast iron rollers are commonly seen on finished Connecticut coins when the planchets were insufficiently annealed, or softened, prior to striking.6 Crosby relates how planchets for Massachusetts coppers were cast into ingots at the Boston mint and then carted to nearby Dedham where the copper "was drawn under a trip-hammer, and rolled into sheets, when it was returned to the mint, where the blanks were prepared and the coin stamped."7 The rolling procedure practiced in England was more complex where the fillets were initially prepared in a horse or water powered "roughing mill," and then passed through a power driven "finishing mill" prior to being brought to exact dimensions by passage through a set of polished, hardened, steel rollers on a hand operated "drag-bench."8" http://numismatics.org/digitallibrary/ark:/53695/nnan48359- 2023-10-27 01:03:58
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- All very interesting; thanks for sharing. More pieces to the puzzle:
Copper flans were most definitely shipped from Britain from 1796 onward. It may have provided opportunities for corrosion in shipping, to your earlier point. Unclear whether 1795 and earlier flans were sourced domestically or rolled by the mint.
https://www.britnumsoc.org/publications/Digital%20BNJ/pdfs/1987_BNJ_57_7.pdf
See the Mint's copper account from 1792-1798. The handwriting is hard to read, but I can make out "Governor and Company" [Britain] in October 1796. And Talbot and Alum in April 1795 - presumably the plain edge restrikes which would have been raw flans or the 1C tokens. Prior purchases in 1794 and 1795 are listed with apparent names of private individuals (tough to read accurately). Whether these were domestic or shipped from Britain or provided as flans or in bulk format are unclear.
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1005688/us-mint-1792-copper-account-page
Either way, it's neat to find these artifacts. Glad you started the conversation.All very interesting; thanks for sharing. More pieces to the puzzle: Copper flans were most definitely shipped from Britain from 1796 onward. It may have provided opportunities for corrosion in shipping, to your earlier point. Unclear whether 1795 and earlier flans were sourced domestically or rolled by the mint. https://www.britnumsoc.org/publications/Digital%20BNJ/pdfs/1987_BNJ_57_7.pdf See the Mint's copper account from 1792-1798. The handwriting is hard to read, but I can make out "Governor and Company" [Britain] in October 1796. And Talbot and Alum in April 1795 - presumably the plain edge restrikes which would have been raw flans or the 1C tokens. Prior purchases in 1794 and 1795 are listed with apparent names of private individuals (tough to read accurately). Whether these were domestic or shipped from Britain or provided as flans or in bulk format are unclear. https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1005688/us-mint-1792-copper-account-page Either way, it's neat to find these artifacts. Glad you started the conversation.- 2023-10-27 03:55:26
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- MarkB3h thanks for those reads. The BNS article jogged my memory better on relation with Britain, and how SOHO Mint became supplier of blanks here, after initial supplier's were of such poor quality.[MarkB3h] thanks for those reads. The BNS article jogged my memory better on relation with Britain, and how SOHO Mint became supplier of blanks here, after initial supplier's were of such poor quality.
- 2023-10-27 04:22:36
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- SilverAge3 it's fascinating to learn that the copper flans arrived in a ready-for-coining state from Britain. I had thought the copper was rolled locally at the Philadelphia mint, but that was more an assumption than any hard evidence. If that explains the common pitting on early coppers with CAC stickers, it makes sense why they are not considered environmental damage. Thank you.[SilverAge3] it's fascinating to learn that the copper flans arrived in a ready-for-coining state from Britain. I had thought the copper was rolled locally at the Philadelphia mint, but that was more an assumption than any hard evidence. If that explains the common pitting on early coppers with CAC stickers, it makes sense why they are not considered environmental damage. Thank you.
- 2023-10-26 18:33:40
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- SilverAge3 I'll try to look into this possible materials sourcing angle.[SilverAge3] I'll try to look into this possible materials sourcing angle.
- 2023-10-26 19:13:16
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- ToddPollock all the visible flaws are flan / planchet as struck. The remaining copper surfaces are pristine.[ToddPollock] all the visible flaws are flan / planchet as struck. The remaining copper surfaces are pristine.
- 2023-10-26 18:31:31
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- Perhaps some of it is due to, my understanding, many planchets being already corroded, pitted, to some degree, before struck. I think some ironically came from Britain. Doubly ironic, in that the US not only had won independence from them, but, as Britain had a dismal lack of smaller denominations, themselves, not manufacturing enough, esp. halfpennies, farthings. Many tokens were struck to help fill the gap, esp as the Counterfeiting Acts made contemporary, aka 'non regal' fake coins more serious offences.
Anyhow, many of the blanks were possibly weathered on the salty sea voyage, and potentially improperly improperly stored here, and abroad before shipped here -- many early British copper pennies also had issues, with pitting from blanks stored in some leaky shed, along with rusty dies. Our coinage shared some of these issues, to my limited understanding.Perhaps some of it is due to, my understanding, many planchets being already corroded, pitted, to some degree, before struck. I think some ironically came from Britain. Doubly ironic, in that the US not only had won independence from them, but, as Britain had a dismal lack of smaller denominations, themselves, not manufacturing enough, esp. halfpennies, farthings. Many tokens were struck to help fill the gap, esp as the Counterfeiting Acts made contemporary, aka 'non regal' fake coins more serious offences. Anyhow, many of the blanks were possibly weathered on the salty sea voyage, and potentially improperly improperly stored here, and abroad before shipped here -- many early British copper pennies also had issues, with pitting from blanks stored in some leaky shed, along with rusty dies. Our coinage shared some of these issues, to my limited understanding.- 2023-10-26 18:12:46
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- This is a very interesting video. I don't know if conservative is the right word for this type of grading. For some of these, I think "wrong" is a better word. Let me know what you think...
https://youtu.be/K8D_qDU_-U0?si=FV62C44g2JjLHzZ1This is a very interesting video. I don't know if conservative is the right word for this type of grading. For some of these, I think "wrong" is a better word. Let me know what you think... https://youtu.be/K8D_qDU_-U0?si=FV62C44g2JjLHzZ1
21 Comments 0 Shares 3121 ViewsCommenting is disabled.- I saw this on you tube before, but i could not watch. mr. ai can go pound sand!!!!I saw this on you tube before, but i could not watch. mr. ai can go pound sand!!!!
- 2024-01-17 20:52:16
View previous replies- EasternIowaBrian I totally agree. Grading is subjective and always will be. It's art, not science.[EasternIowaBrian] I totally agree. Grading is subjective and always will be. It's art, not science.
- 2024-01-17 20:58:50
- RyanG it could be science, but without a ground truth that can be agreed upon, you won't get meaningful results from AI grading. The video simultaneously shows both the lack of such ground truth and lack of understanding of how necessary it is.[RyanG] it could be science, but without a ground truth that can be agreed upon, you won't get meaningful results from AI grading. The video simultaneously shows both the lack of such ground truth and lack of understanding of how necessary it is.
- 2024-01-17 21:32:46
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- messydesk Maybe the guy who made the video should have had AI screen his coins first.[messydesk] Maybe the guy who made the video should have had AI screen his coins first.
- 2024-01-17 21:36:32
- [ToddPollock] 😂
- 2024-01-17 21:38:36
- ToddPollock AI being Artificial or Actual intelligence?[ToddPollock] AI being Artificial or Actual intelligence?
- 2024-01-17 21:46:17
- I think it’s wiser to submit PCGS & NGC coins to CAC for consideration for a CAC sticker. If it doesn’t sticker, then one still has the original grade in the holder without any downgrading. If it does sticker, then that’s the cherry on top.I think it’s wiser to submit PCGS & NGC coins to CAC for consideration for a CAC sticker. If it doesn’t sticker, then one still has the original grade in the holder without any downgrading. If it does sticker, then that’s the cherry on top.
- 2024-01-01 07:39:05
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- Chefquack There are definitely wiser things to do than cracking out coins and seeing how it goes.[Chefquack] There are definitely wiser things to do than cracking out coins and seeing how it goes.
- 2024-01-02 17:11:16
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- I think they have (strict) standards and they are sticking to them.
All of the TPGs started off that way, and had to adjust as the marketplace corrected their ways. It remains to be seen if CACG has deep enough pockets to say no and for how long.
I predict it won't last and we'll be talking about "Early CACG" coins getting a premium.
Ultimately the market needs consistency. If a PCGS 70 is an NGC 70.1 and a CACG 69.5 - consistently - the market can adjust.I think they have (strict) standards and they are sticking to them. All of the TPGs started off that way, and had to adjust as the marketplace corrected their ways. It remains to be seen if CACG has deep enough pockets to say no and for how long. I predict it won't last and we'll be talking about "Early CACG" coins getting a premium. Ultimately the market needs consistency. If a PCGS 70 is an NGC 70.1 and a CACG 69.5 - consistently - the market can adjust.- 2023-12-31 16:34:51
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- IgnoredByMyCats Good point. A rattler with good eye appeal always brings a strong premium.[IgnoredByMyCats] Good point. A rattler with good eye appeal always brings a strong premium.
- 2023-12-31 21:30:39
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- I haven't posted in some time so here is another coin that I hope the community enjoys.I haven't posted in some time so here is another coin that I hope the community enjoys.
6 Comments 0 Shares 1423 ViewsCommenting is disabled.- A wonderful AU example! I have one I’ll keep forever too.A wonderful AU example! I have one I’ll keep forever too.
- 2024-01-13 15:22:14
- Cncorwin I posted a nice coin. You posted a PHENOMENAL coin! Great date with a very nice well-struck look. I am honored that you would post such a wonderful coin under my post. Your coin should be in its own post.[Cncorwin] I posted a nice coin. You posted a PHENOMENAL coin! Great date with a very nice well-struck look. I am honored that you would post such a wonderful coin under my post. Your coin should be in its own post.
- 2024-01-14 03:54:35
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- Booth 1225
Accepting submissions for both Grading and Stickering this Thursday through Saturday while also showcasing a landmark display at the table. See you there!Booth 1225 Accepting submissions for both Grading and Stickering this Thursday through Saturday while also showcasing a landmark display at the table. See you there!
0 Comments 0 Shares 1370 Views - Nothing much... Just a STUNNING piece in auction now at DLRC!Nothing much... Just a STUNNING piece in auction now at DLRC!DLRC December 3rd Auction Highlight!
An impressive gem 1878 $3 PCGS/CAC MS66 ex: Bass Collection! The 1878 $3 Princess is by far the most plentiful date in the series and the most available in high grade. As such, it is the ideal choice for type collectors. The collector seeking a visually stunning gem example needs to look no further! From the famed Harry W. Bass Jr. Collection, only two finer examples have earned CAC approval. The present offering features luminous mint luster shining from sharply defined fields complimented by stunning straw-gold coloration. The eye appeal is truly magnificent and included with the coin is the original tag from the collection. View this coin and place your bid now! https://davidlawrence.com/auctions/lot/763852
#pcgs #cac #rarecoins #uscoins #keydate #coincollecting #coins #numismatics #dlrc #gold #threedollar #gem #unc #original #bass #collection #harrybass #available #auction #forsale #bidnow
cacgrading2 Comments 0 Shares 2456 ViewsCommenting is disabled. - Just listed some PCGS CAC coins on the Collectors forum. Feel free to message me here or there (ideally) if interested. Here’s the list:
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1097007/fsho-pcgs-cac-peace-dollars-1921-1922-1927-type-coins-2c-h10c-2-5-indian-all-w-trueview
1864 2c MS64BN
1871 H10c AU55
1921 $1 Peace MS62
1922 $1 MS65+
1927 $1 MS64
1908 $2.5 AU58
1936 50c Long Is MS65Just listed some PCGS CAC coins on the Collectors forum. Feel free to message me here or there (ideally) if interested. Here’s the list: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1097007/fsho-pcgs-cac-peace-dollars-1921-1922-1927-type-coins-2c-h10c-2-5-indian-all-w-trueview 1864 2c MS64BN 1871 H10c AU55 1921 $1 Peace MS62 1922 $1 MS65+ 1927 $1 MS64 1908 $2.5 AU58 1936 50c Long Is MS650 Comments 0 Shares 1624 Views - New purchase. 1858 is the second lowest mintage of all 1850’s Philadelphia mint double eagles. With a mintage of 211,714, only about 1,035 are estimated to survive in all grades. Only 68 through ALL grades are approved by CAC and only 4 in this grade. Ex. Fairmont Collection. This is for sale via private message
New purchase. 1858 is the second lowest mintage of all 1850’s Philadelphia mint double eagles. With a mintage of 211,714, only about 1,035 are estimated to survive in all grades. Only 68 through ALL grades are approved by CAC and only 4 in this grade. Ex. Fairmont Collection. This is for sale via private message
2 Comments 0 Shares 3170 ViewsCommenting is disabled. - CACG grades world coins?!CACG grades world coins?!1 Comments 0 Shares 2007 Views
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